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 Now I am become Death, destroyer of worlds (also known as) The Necromancer Thread

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AOTT
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PostSubject: Now I am become Death, destroyer of worlds (also known as) The Necromancer Thread   Thu Jul 11, 2013 9:30 pm

Now, I'm not a build expert nor am I particularly well-versed in the mathematics behind what makes a build as efficient as possible.  However, I do know when something works out well.  My favorite class is the necromancer.  I've run the same thing for the vast majority of my time playing, and it has served me well, but it's also incredibly slow.  So I've modified it and turned it into something of a monster.  So I figured I'd share what I've come up with and maybe pick up some ideas.

The purpose of this thread is to share various approaches to building Necromancers.  Let's put down a few ground rules, shall we?
-Tanky builds are to be compared to tanky builds.
-Zerky/Power builds are to be compared to zerky/power builds.
-Condition damage builds are to be compared to condition damage builds.
-Support builds are to be compared to support builds.
-Do not cross-compare build types (i.e. compare a tank to a damage build) unless you have posted two of your own builds which you wish to compare.
-If you are criticizing a build posted by another player, you MUST post your own build/modification of what you think that build ought to be, USING THIS TOOL: http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/
-This thread is about NECROMANCERS.  If you don't like necromancers, don't post about some other class in this thread.
-If you don't think the rules are fair, tough noogies.

Let's start off with my own builds.  Plural.  I'm partial to Minion Masters.  Yes, minion AI gives many players trouble.  There are many myths and truths regarding the behavior and effectiveness of minions.  I haven't had those kinds of problems.  Maybe I'm just really good at minion mastery.  Maybe I'm just patient enough to wait the 2-3 seconds it takes for a minion to stop derping out and go attack the target.  Anyway, I have two builds that I use.

Currently, I use this: http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQNAW7YjMal6ta2a07JCpHPLaTD+w7jZcsgB-jgyAIskh0iMtIQkHY6DGlAJHWEN2qZR0YV3Y6YioaA-e
This thing is a condition damage monster.  Look at this.  Not only is it tough as a brick wall, it converts that toughness to condition damage (Runes of the Undead), and power (Death 25, Deadly Strength).  Then it converts that Power into healing (Spite 15, Death into Life).  Consider also that there is additional toughness per minion (Death 15, Protection of the Horde) for, in this case, +100 toughness.  And of course, any minion master that knows how survival-prne minions actually are will be running Death Nova, which creates huge poison fields when minions die.  Instead of trying to make minions last longer, accept they are going to die anyway and get Minion Master (Death III, 20% faster recharge on minion skills) so you can send them out there to die over and over.
If you flip one of the minions (I suggest shadow fiend or bone fiend) to Blood is Power, you get a pretty sexy might stack bonus and BiP's massive bleed, but I don't really see the point as long as you have warriors or guardians in the party that grant might anyway.
Of course, this build can flip to Plague/Wells readily, or (if you're insane) some weird epidemic thing.
I don't consider this a tank build because, although it is very tough, it lacks extra death shroud and doesn't have extra healing.

Previously, I used this:http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQNBmQDbkRrUvVzWjePBI945oneSB3gTpw90B-jwxAIMioZCCMZZIa5vioxWfLiGr6GTBTEVDA-e
A word about the equipment.  The equipment is a half-lie here.  This build does not, for all practical purposes, require equipment of any kind and so it was a moot point.  It's that tough.  I'm sure some of you know what I used to use.  Let's not discuss that further.  I'm sure there are far, far better equipment setups that I could use for this build.  I must say, however, that optimizing this build would be a crime against humanity.  This is the build that I compared to the horribly slow murderer with the incredibly inefficient weapon.
Enough about that.  This is like the polar opposite of the build above it.  The minions are still dying off quickly, but every attack gives this build health back.  The Death Shroud has a massive pool.  The minions die and produce poison fields, making it harder for enemies to heal.  This build works, literally, by outliving your opponents.  I had used this almost exclusively for the 9 months prior to joining ToA, at which point people wanted me to kill things faster.  Maybe that's why I have inhuman patience.
It's super awesome in PvP and WvW though.  I don't know why.

I've tried power builds with Necromancer, but I find them distasteful.  Let's see what some other people are running!

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PostSubject: Re: Now I am become Death, destroyer of worlds (also known as) The Necromancer Thread   Fri Aug 16, 2013 2:50 pm

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQEQNBmODbkRLdvYzTjhPRIV4aQPeftcW0jhFMmB-jACBoeERzEEwkFDRL5rIasVNFRjVVjIqWXDzIuIa1A-e

Tell me what you think of this, I just kinda threw it together because of the new celestial gear.  It's a power build, obviously.

(EDIT: forgot there were still minions on that bar, fix'd)

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PostSubject: Re: Now I am become Death, destroyer of worlds (also known as) The Necromancer Thread   Fri Aug 16, 2013 3:50 pm

wouldn't call it a power build, more like hybrid.

For one, it runs celestial gear, if you want to build for a power build, run full berserker since there is plenty of ways to get health back / blind / keep enemies at bay. 

Secondly, any power build for necro needs well of suffering, the vulnerability stacking plus crit ticks on the well itself make for great spike damage.

To complement that spike damage, run dagger/focus on swap for more vulnerability stacking (Reaper's touch is amazing damage up close since the high number of bounces) and that fast, life force building, auto attack on dagger. Staff is a great weapon, but it is more of a support weapon to swap too and than back to your main set.

I personally run a build that builds my Life force pool very fast, has very nice spike damage and more than enough survivability to get in close. Running 25 in Soul Reaping and having 'Near to death' on my master trait allows me to have fury up most of the time for loads of crits, while getting a nice bump in damage for Life blasting when my LF is above 50%, when i see my LF bar half full, go back and build your LF to max etc..

The main tactic for this build is to double tap F1 every 6 seconds for fury and cause some AoE weakness and bleeding + some damage every 15 seconds with running 'Weakening Shroud' as an adept mark from the curses trait line. (Weakening Shroud does not have a recharge according to the trait menu, but in reality it is 15 seconds.

Because I run my nec in WvW and PvE, I opt for a build that has an all-round feel but wouldn't fall in the hybrid category. When running in WvW, I change out 2 adept and one major mark, and leaves me with more range on my focus for 1200 range chills plus chills on blind for zerging with plague.

There are plenty of good power builds out there, this one is a lil weird as far as traits go, but is a lot of fun if this is your style of melee.

10/25/0/10/25,

Dagger/focus - Axe/warhorn(or dagger depending on the situation)
Staff - Axe/Warhorn for wvw zerging with adapted traits

In case anyone wants to try this kind of build out, I'd be happy to walk you through the skill rotation and the trait numbers for pve and wvw.
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PostSubject: Re: Now I am become Death, destroyer of worlds (also known as) The Necromancer Thread   Fri Aug 16, 2013 7:57 pm


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PostSubject: Re: Now I am become Death, destroyer of worlds (also known as) The Necromancer Thread   Fri Aug 16, 2013 8:42 pm

put the sig of fire on your dagger since that is your main set.

I run ruby orbs myself on armor, it's a nice bump in all 3 stats, but if you can keep up fury for the most part, you can get away with runes that don't carry precision.

The adept mark for the spite line has 3 good options, depending on what you want for a specific situation. I usually run the focus recharge or the retaliation when entering DS since I tend to DS hop more than stay in it, but that all changes if your doing a lot of boss fights where stacking might becomes more important, there you opt for reaper's might.

Adding more to that stacking of might would be the corruption recharge trait from the curses major marks. The ranged wells is quite pointless in this build, I use well of darkness in dungeons now and than to back up my plague for perma blinds on trash groups that need it, so you would be in melee anyways.

I stick to the siphon health on crits for the blood magic adept mark, you end up with loads of life stealing over time. Put 15 in blood for even more life stealing but I doubt you'd need it if you can handle yourself on a nec.
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PostSubject: Re: Now I am become Death, destroyer of worlds (also known as) The Necromancer Thread   Sat Aug 17, 2013 1:28 pm

I've been running THIS for a while now, based on Matti's advice plus a few twists of my own. The differences are that I rely a lot more on wells, I don't bother hopping in and out of DS so much, and I've gambling a lot on staying above 90% health. To be honest I wish I could have 105 trait points (enough to go 30/25/0/25/25) and get all those damage bonuses - I would willingly sacrifice all but the top trait in each line if that was possible. Basically every line except Death Magic has at least 1 really awesome trait that I'd love to get, but ALL of the adept and master traits are kinda underwhelming.
Anyway, in WvW and PvP there are some excellent setups, while in dungeons the unique thing you can do is provide respectable DPS without being at all squishy. I chose scholar runes and an emphasis on Blood Magic to make the most of this. However, having tried this out for a while, maybe I'm ready to move on to something a little bit different. It needs to either have a lot of damage or support for the team... or a bit of both. Any suggestions?

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